SIGRIST:

This is Paul Sigrist for the National Park Service. Today is Thursday, April 21st, I believe. Is it the 21st? Yes. 21st, 1994. I am at Elizabeth, New Jersey, with Ceil Miller.

SIGRIST:

Mrs. Miller . . .

MILLER:

No. (?) I became Miller here.

SIGRIST:

What was your name in Russia?

MILLER:

Aronowitz.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell that?

MILLER:

Yeah, I think so. A-R-O-N-O-W-I-T-Z.

SIGRIST:

And was your first name Ceil?

MILLER:

Celia.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell that?

MILLER:

Celia. Uh, I had two names, but it was, in Jewish, I could spell it the Jewish way. Yeah.

SIGRIST:

How old were you when you came to America?

MILLER:

That's what I don't remember.

SIGRIST:

( he laughs ) Oh, okay. Do you know what year it was?

MILLER:

I think it was 1910.

SIGRIST:

You came in 1910.

MILLER:

I think so, yeah.

SIGRIST:

And I have written down that your birth date is December 15, 1897.

MILLER:

That's right.

SIGRIST:

That's correct.

MILLER:

That's, the year that I, when I come over, I could start kindergarten here, I went on, you know, to all grades. I don't know how many. But, uh, it's, on the 15th of December, so I got a Khanuka.

SIGRIST:

That was that date that they chose for you. Can you tell me what town you were born in?

MILLER:

Hmm?

SIGRIST:

What town were you born in?

MILLER:

Where? In Europe?

SIGRIST:

In Europe.

MILLER:

I was born in Kricun[ph]. That's what was a dorf [village]. You know what a dorf is? Yeah, a dorf. Kricun[ph]. It's near, it was near Itsran[ph], (?) Vilna, yeah.

SIGRIST:

So this is in what is now Lithuania?

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Where you were born.

MILLER:

It was then Lithuania, too.

SIGRIST:

It was Lithuania then.

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

When you were born.

MILLER:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember the house that you grew up in? Did you grow up in one house?

MILLER:

No. Then we moved to Anikst[ph]. Anikst[ph] was also a larger town than (?). [not understood] was a dorf And we lived there until we came to America.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe for me your house in that town?

MILLER:

Uh, I don't remember. It was like an apartment, like an apartment. It had bed-- two bedrooms and, uh, a kitchen. We needed a kitchen, you know. I don't think we had a - a - a dining room. And, uh, a bedroom. I think. You know, it's hard for me to remember but I think that's what it was.

SIGRIST:

Did you have a stove in the kitchen?

MILLER:

No. Had a - a -- what do you call - a—a -- a stove with a pot, with a top, you know, an eyven, an eyven [an oven]. They called it an eyven there. And, uh, we had a top. We used to sleep on it. It was warm on the top of the stove.

SIGRIST:

Like a platform to sleep on?

MILLER:

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Did, um, what did you eat when you were a child growing up? What kinds of food did your mother cook?

MILLER:

Oh. ( she laughs ) We had chicken, veal, you know, and borscht, mostly borscht. They like borscht there.

SIGRIST:

How do you make borscht? How did your mother make borscht?

MILLER:

With beets, or cabbage. A cabbage borscht, or be of beef. She cooks it with a piece of meat I think, you know, like they cook it here. It's no different. It's so long, what do you want me to . . . ( she laughs ) My memory is still not.

SIGRIST:

What was your father's name?

MILLER:

His name is Leyvy.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell that?

MILLER:

Aron Leyvy.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell?

MILLER:

Well, he, well, he, he came from Hogera[ph]. That's also a Lithuanian town. He lived in Hogera.

SIGRIST:

What do you know about your father's background, his family background?

MILLER:

He liked the ladies. ( she laughs ) And, he was good. He was a good man.

SIGRIST:

What did he look like?

MILLER:

He was a good looking man, good looking.

SIGRIST:

Tall?

MILLER:

Good looking.

SIGRIST:

Short?

MILLER:

We're all short in the family. My children are short, too. They weren't tall. In fact, I don't - don.t have any more children. My children died. I had two sons. They passed away. But they - they weren't tall. One is short (?).

SIGRIST:

What was his personality like?

MILLER:

He was, he was a good man. He was good. I tell you, he liked to have parties, you know, he liked to visit, go with women, like a young man. ( she laughs )

SIGRIST:

What did he do for a living in Europe?

MILLER:

Oh, he used to, let me see. He, he was, uh, he was a butcher. He h—he had, buy cattle in a butcher store, and then he used to sell eggs, and that's the main thing. Eggs, and, uh, I went to kheder [parochial school] in Europe. I didn't go to school. And . . .

SIGRIST:

What was your mother's name?

MILLER:

My mother's name was Sora, Sora Raykha.

SIGRIST:

Do you know what her maiden name was before she was married?

MILLER:

Let me see. Uh, ay, yay, yay [oh, oh, oh]. I knew, I knew, I knew her name. Ah . . . I knew the name, but I can't think.

SIGRIST:

Maybe you'll think of it later. Did she come from that same town?

MILLER:

My mother did, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Do you know how your parents met?

MILLER:

Oh, that's, Kalman, Kalman's mother, the man that lived in Rogava[ph]. And he lived in Rogava[ph]. My aunt was, it was, of course, my mother's, I don't know what it is, her niece, it must have been her niece, she introduced him to my mother, but he didn't like it. Every yea—every day he used to be mad at her. He didn't like, my mother's a beautiful lady, and good, a good lady. But my father was more orderly -- worldly, worldly. [not understood] Just leave my mother, you know, he'd go after ladies. Ah, he was okay. ( she laughs )

SIGRIST:

Was it a large family in Russia? Did you have brothers and sisters?

MILLER:

(?)

SIGRIST:

Did you have brothers and sisters when you lived in Europe?

MILLER:

I had four brothers, and I had another sister. We were six.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember everybody's name?

MILLER:

I remember Ruby - [not understood] Irene's father's name is Meyshe, Meyshe Khaya, yeah. Irene, is she here?

SIGRIST:

Yeah, they're sitting in another part of the room.

MILLER:

Irene, make Meyshe's father, yeah. And then Afoyam[ph], and Gilbert[ph] came over. He was five years old when he came over. He was the youngest. They're all dead. (?) And so it's four, and my sister was Yerfene [ph] Yente. You always had two names, but Yente, Yette, and she, she died. She has a son, three sons, and they're, one's in Chicago, one lives in New York, Jewish Hospital. He's a doctor there. In, what's New York? What's that city, New York? I forget the name of it. He lives in Teaneck, but he's in New York.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember going to synagogue in Europe?

MILLER:

Well . . .

SIGRIST:

Was there a synagogue in your town?

MILLER:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was a synagogue.

SIGRIST:

Were you a religious family?

MILLER:

Well, my mother was religious. My father was, too, you know, but not, she was so sick, my mother, and she, and she, even in this country she was very sick.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe how you celebrated Passover in Europe?

MILLER:

Oh, my father used to sit with the pillow in angeleynt [leaning], you know? ( she laughs ) And he'd be very, very nice seder, beautiful seder. I -- his father—very holy man. When they, when they call for the, someone to come in, who is that that come in? Do you know anything about the seder?

SIGRIST:

Is it Elijah who comes in? Is it Elijah? Yes, when Elijah comes?

MILLER:

He brings in, he brings in a, a, uh, animal, you know? ( she laughs ) But that's what he did, he used to have a big pillow, you know? And say, you know, celebrate, and read the pesa--, what do you call the book? I forget.

SIGRIST:

The Talmud?

MILLER:

Hagode. Hagode, Hagode]. Hagoda [Passover prayer book]. And, uh, it was a nice seder becaue my mother was really, veryreligious.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember going to school in Lithuania?

MILLER:

I don't remember. I wasn't old enough. There you've got to be a little older to go to school. So that's why I think I was, I say I was seven, maybe I was, my daughter said I was ten, so maybe I was ten. I don't remember. It's a long time.

SIGRIST:

A long time ago.

MILLER:

Eighty years. Who can remember?

SIGRIST:

Do you remember any games that you played when you were a little girl in Europe? How did you have fun when you were a little girl in Europe?

MILLER:

I can't think. You played some kind of games. I can't think of it. It's -- I can't think.

SIGRIST:

Well, did somebody in your family come to America first?

MILLER:

OH, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Who came?

MILLER:

Well, first I had an aunt that, an uncle that came with his son, his daughter, his name was Yehuda, and he had a daughter that died here, he brought her. And then his wife followed him. So Irene's father went with them, and my father, also my father came here after they did, because they had, like, you know, acquaintance, they had somebody they knew here. And Irene's father came with Zint[ph], and so did Yehuda.

SIGRIST:

What job did your father get when he came to America first?

MILLER:

Oh, he didn't have much of a job. He, they used to bake potatoes, sweet potatoes, and sell. Do you remember that? ( she laughs ) In New York, we lived. We came to New York, and we lived on Rutger Street.

SIGRIST:

Before you came, you're still in Europe . . .

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Is that what your father is doing here in New York, selling the sweet potatoes?

MILLER:

He made a living from that, you know.

SIGRIST:

How long was your father here before you came?

MILLER:

I think two years. Then I came with my, my sister, I had a, my youngest brother, I think the three of us came with my mother.

SIGRIST:

Did your mother want to leave Europe? Did your mother want to leave Europe?

MILLER:

Where?

SIGRIST:

Did your mother want to stay in Europe rather than come to America?

MILLER:

Well, she was young also. My you—my younger brother was about five years old, Gilbert. His name is Gilbert.

SIGRIST:

But did your mother want to leave her family in Europe?

MILLER:

Well, she didn't have many. Most of them died, you know? She didn't have, they all were here. She had a sister and a brother here.

SIGRIST:

Did you have grandparents in Europe?

MILLER:

I don't remember.

SIGRIST:

Not that you remember.

MILLER:

Again, you know, that's so many years, I don't remember them. I had [not understood] for her father and her mother, they also lived around there in the same towns, in the small town, a dorf And, uh . . .

SIGRIST:

But you don't remember them.

MILLER:

No, no. They died before I was born.

SIGRIST:

Do you know, do you know what you thought about America before you got here?

MILLER:

Well, everybody raved, you know, in Europe. Oh, America, beautiful land, the best land really. And, uh, people that I knew had relatives here. They, uh, they said that it very good, America's the best land. It was then the best land, too. You had to say God Bless America.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember what you packed when you left Lithuania? What did you take with you?

MILLER:

Well, I just took my clothes - whatever I had -- I didn't have much. And what else could I take? You know, I was young.

SIGRIST:

What about your mother? What did she pack?

MILLER:

She also had, she packed, you know, her clothes. When she came here, she got new clothes.

SIGRIST:

Did your mother bring any food with her?

MILLER:

No. The ship gave you enough - enough food, good food. It was kosher, like parva kosher foods, you know, it wasn't pure gravy. Like bacon and stuff like that, they never served that.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember where you got the ship? Where . . .

MILLER:

I just - I just saw it (?) in, oh, [not understood] .

SIGRIST:

Was it Vilna?

MILLER:

It wasn't a, it was a Russian, you know, Vilna, not Vilna. Vilna -- had an aunt living there. Now what? Mention some.

SIGRIST:

Well, maybe it will come to you as we go. Do you remember how you traveled from your town to wherever it was you got the ship?

MILLER:

We traveled, Europe had trains then, too.

SIGRIST:

You took a train.

MILLER:

A train, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Was that a long trip that you remember?

MILLER:

It was quite a while. I don't know why I can't remember the town, I went during the night. I remember that. You just, you just forget. I forget things now, too, a little bit.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember seeing he ship for the first time?

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

What did that look like to you?

MILLER:

It was a real big ship, and they had, you know, they had, you had to rest, sit down on chairs, and stuff like that. I'm just trying to think, I knew during the night what it was. Like the ship, the name of the ship, the name of the ship I think was Bremen. Was there a Bremen?

SIGRIST:

Bremen?

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Bremen, yes, there was, indeed. Sure.

MILLER:

Yeah, Bremen. On the Bremen. We came on the Bremen.

SIGRIST:

The Bremen was a big ship.

MILLER:

Yeah, very big, and very nice.

SIGRIST:

What else do you remember about being on the ship? What was the experience like for you?

MILLER:

Well, nothing there that I could remember. Maybe how our meal was, you know? And sometimes they serve refreshments, like fruit and stuff, they'd go around and serve it to the people, the passengers. And then we'd have our meals. And we had - we had lots of sleep.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe for me where you slept, what it looked like on the ship?

MILLER:

That's, uh, that's hard. And, I know I was resting good, that's all. I slept good there.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember what time of the year you were on the ship, what month that you left?

MILLER:

I don't know. When I came here, what does it say? In December? I thought I came, I don't know what month, but I know it was the tenth, the tenth then.

SIGRIST:

Because of Hanukah you remember that.

MILLER:

Hanukah yeah, yeah. And Hanukah's my birthday, so, in there.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember being seasick on the ship?

MILLER:

I was, horrible. Well, I used to go on my husband's year.

SIGRIST:

Much later.

MILLER:

Much later. And I, I, you know, I used to get sick. I don't remember where we went.

SIGRIST:

Do you know how long the ship was?

MILLER:

I don't know. No.

SIGRIST:

Did it, did it take a long time to get to America?

MILLER:

It took, I don't know, about a year I think. No?

SIGRIST:

No, when you were on the ship.

MILLER:

Yeah?

SIGRIST:

How long it took to get across the Atlantic Ocean?

MILLER:

It took about a year I think, no?

SIGRIST:

It would be less than that.

MILLER:

Less than that.

SIGRIST:

Yeah.

MILLER:

Maybe.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember seeing the Statue of Liberty when you came into New York Harbor?

MILLER:

Yeah. And then, as I say, then we came to, what do you call it, to, I told you about that man walking around saying . . .

SIGRIST:

You had to go to Ellis Island.

MILLER:

Ellis Island, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Tell me about the man again. Tell me, what was the man saying?

MILLER:

I don't know his name.

SIGRIST:

No, but what was he saying to you?

MILLER:

Oh, he was saying, "Sit down, sit down, sit down, sit down." You know, to all the people, sit down meaning where you should sit, you know? And I didn't know what that meant at that time. I didn't know what sit down means. And I sit down anyway. And then my father was there, and my aunt, I have an aunt that was there before, before us. In fact, that aunt, Irene's father, came to America with her when she came. She came about maybe, maybe a year before us.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember anything else about Ellis Island? Do you remember being examined by a doctor?

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

What did they do?

MILLER:

They examined you like a doctor does, you know? He examined your eyes. Your eyes, especially. That was very important. You had to have good eyes to come in this country. If your eyes weren't good, like I had bad eyes for a while, the cone, the cone, they called it. So I went to, uh, where did I go? I went to some town near Korve [ph], not in Korve . But near there, Pondarus [ph]. I went to a doctor, he cured my eyes, that I was able to come.

SIGRIST:

Yeah. So the doctor cured you, so you were able to get through at Ellis Island.

MILLER:

At Ellis Island, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember eating at Ellis Island?

MILLER:

I think so. I don't remember what we ate, but we had to eat, we were there a whole day. We came in during the night. And the next morning they all came to - to - to to take us home, wherever, an apartment or something.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember, do you remember where that apartment was that . . .

MILLER:

Rutgers Street.

SIGRIST:

What was the street?

MILLER:

Rutgers, in New York, downtown. Do you know where that is?

SIGRIST:

CAn you describe the apartment, what it looked like?

MILLER:

I told you, it had a bedroom, it had, it had a kitchen, and it had a stove. They used to use wood for the stove, to make the stove. My mother, she's religious, so she used to -- a woman used to come in to make - have -- on Saturday to start the stove. One time my brother, he was very funny, Irene's father, he got dressed up like a woman, and came in to make the stove. My mother looked at him, and looked at him. Ay, Mishele[ph], Mishele[ph]. She recognized him. That was mis-- you know. He was -- he's a funny with, Irene's fa - father is very funny. And they got jobs, too, someplace, when they came here. They got jobs. A movie . . .

SIGRIST:

Now, did you stay with your aunt in her apartment for a while? When you first got here . . .

MILLER:

Yeah, we stayed, yeah.

SIGRIST:

You stayed with your aunt.

MILLER:

Until we moved to Roselle.

SIGRIST:

And did you move with your father to Roselle?

MILLER:

No, I, my mother was already, when I went - when I was with my father, my mother was here already, too, with me. I came with my mother.

SIGRIST:

Right, right.

MILLER:

My father came alone. He wasn't here but for maybe a year, or maybe longer without us, and then he made enough money and sent us money to come, you know, to pay for the ticket to come here. But, uh . . .

SIGRIST:

Did your mother work when she got to America?

MILLER:

Nah, uh-uh.

SIGRIST:

No?

MILLER:

Mother didn't work, no.

SIGRIST:

Now, did your father continue selling the potatoes?

MILLER:

Yes. When we came to Roselle, he had a butcher store. He here, he got into a butcher store, and he made a very nice living for us. Some of the words-- I don't know which ones didn't work with help of, you know.

SIGRIST:

Can you tell me how you learned English?

MILLER:

When I went to school.

SIGRIST:

What was it like to go to school in America?

MILLER:

It was nice, it was nice, but I had to learn the language.

SIGRIST:

Was that hard?

MILLER:

Well, it's hard. You -- you don't know how to, you know, what it's all about. Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Can you, can you tell me a little bit about what it was like to go to school when you got to America?

MILLER:

You know something? I must tell you something. There's a man here, well, he's, uh, he was sick. Frank Halad[ph]. He went to, he lived in Roselle also, and we both went to school together, to kindergarten. And now he's here, he lives here. A very nice man.

SIGRIST:

So when you got to America, they put you into kindergarten.

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

But you were older than that.

MILLER:

No, well, I wasn't much older. He was ninety-four.

SIGRIST:

No, no. I mean, when you got to America, they put you into kindergarten?

MILLER:

Yeah. See, that's why I thought I was seven years old or eight years old. But then you said the reason my grand, daughter-in-law, her husband passed away nebekh [unfortunately], and she, she says from - from by the certain mails back there, that she thinks that I was ten years old. But I don't know exactly, you know? So, uh . . .

SIGRIST:

Did your mother like being in America?

MILLER:

Yeah, she liked it.

SIGRIST:

Was there something very difficult for her to adjust to there?

MILLER:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Why?

MILLER:

It was. Well, she was very, very religious, very religious. She, she fasted all, all, all, in the holidays that just you're supposed to fast, everything. There's several holidays over the Jewish, you know, year that they, they have to fast, like Tishe B'ov, certain holidays like that, she did. She fasted them all, all she did. And she was very religious. She wanted the children to be like her, but the children weren't so religious, you know.

SIGRIST:

Do you think that people were more religious in Europe than they were here in America?

MILLER:

Well, it depends who they were. My mother was just as religious here, very religious.

SIGRIST:

When you lived in Europe, did you ever experience any antisemitism? When you lived in Lithuania, did you ever experience a pogrom, or your parents talking about experiencing a pogrom?

MILLER:

Yeah, well. They used to come in - we had the [not understood] on the stoves, I was on top of the stoves, I was resting, and all the Russian people came rushing, you know? They came in, sometimes they would take things, you know? Like that's they didn't like. But they come in, what are you going to do? They'd come. They're coming from a different city. And it was as bad, it was bad. That was bad.

SIGRIST:

And this would happen from time to time, correct?

MILLER:

From time to time, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I remember all the time I was - I was sleeping on the stove, on top of the stove, and some, some of them came in, some men. Not the women, but the men came in. A pogrom, a pogrom, you know, they called it.

SIGRIST:

Did you ever see anyone get killed or hurt during a pogrom?

MILLER:

Well, I wasn't very clo—wasn't clo-- near that time, but they did. They pick up -- a lot of them we heard they were families was the children, and then they, the wo—those -- some of the girls were there, they ruined the girls, you know? They were - they were very mean.

SIGRIST:

Well, we'll get you back to America.

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

When you were in America, what was, what was your favorite part about America? What did you like the most about being here?

MILLER:

Well, I, see, we lived in Roselle, I told you. Going to school is nice in there.

SIGRIST:

Were there lots of immigrants that lived in Roselle?

MILLER:

Yeah, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Were they mostly Jewish?

MILLER:

Yeah, Jewish people, but I knew, I knew, uh, some friends my father knew from Europe, I didn't know them, but he did. And, uh, when we came, they took us in. And then we got a house to live in. And it was nice. I liked it.

SIGRIST:

Did your parents learn how to speak English?

MILLER:

They - they spoke, my father. My mother didn't speak much English, my father did. Broken English but he, you know, he spoke English a little bit. And he used to, as I say, he used to go to, he was a butcher. He used to go to Roselle. There was a - a - a train coming there, and he'd get meats, you know, they had sides of cows and cut it up and sell it, and then in Europe, too, he used to get eggs and sell them. I mean, you know, that was his business. END OF SIDE ONE BEGINNING OF SIDE TWO

SIGRIST:

Did your parents ever want to go back?

MILLER:

No, never.

SIGRIST:

To Europe?

MILLER:

Never. They liked it. They liked this country. My mother did, too. And my father, he was -- they say he was a free man, you know, he liked to go here and liked to go there, and he enjoyed being in America.

SIGRIST:

Are there certain things that your parents taught you, certain values that your parents tried to instill in you when you were growing up, things to live by?

MILLER:

They didn't. I -- if they did, I forgot. I forget some things here. After all, so many years. If I came here ten years, even ten years, it's already how many years?

SIGRIST:

It's a long time.

MILLER:

A long time.

SIGRIST:

A long time.

MILLER:

To remember. I'm glad I remember what I do, you know? Even now, uh, I remember, uh, as I told you, the telephone is wonderful. I would pick up the telephone, and I'd call a neighbor of mine that I had, not Jewish. I had a couple of Gentile people that lived near me here, and I lived in, uh, Edison, Edison, New Jersey. I lived in Edison, New Jersey. I had an apartment. You see, some of our home, we built it.

SIGRIST:

When did you get married?

MILLER:

When the war stopped, the first war.

SIGRIST:

The First World War?

MILLER:

Yeah, the First World War. Because the children were in the Second World War, but my husband was in the First.

SIGRIST:

What was your husband's name?

MILLER:

Abe, Abe Miller. Abraham Miller.

SIGRIST:

And was he born in Europe, too?

MILLER:

He was born in Rahway.

SIGRIST:

He was born in Rahway.

MILLER:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Was he older than you, or younger?

MILLER:

Ah, I think I, they tell me I was a little older. So, but he's a very nice man. You know, he was with a company during the war, and he have a --they - they have a metal business. They did so well. I only have a mink coat, a long mink coat, a mink jacket and a mink stole. That's all I had. ( she laughs )

SIGRIST:

Enough to keep you warm.

MILLER:

It kept me warm.

SIGRIST:

Do you still speak any Yiddish?

MILLER:

Yeah, I do, sure.

SIGRIST:

Could you say, maybe a prayer or something for us in Yiddish on tape? Is there something you remember? Could you just say a few lines of something?

MILLER:

I remember it. I don't [not understood] I used to say Borukh ato Adonoy eloyheynu melekh haoylem asher kideshonu bemitzvoseynu lehadlikh nir shel shabos.

SIGRIST:

And what does that mean?

MILLER:

Bentsh likht. When you light candles. Are you Jewish? You're not even Jewish.

SIGRIST:

No.

MILLER:

No wonder! ( she laughs ) No wonder. No, that's, I used to, now I gave my candlesticks to my granddaughter, and she lights them. And here we have our shabat, like tomorrow, yeah, in this, in the home. And, uh, they, they have a man that - that sings. The men, the men, the women, they all -- they have a good time. And, uh, he bentshes - he says a prayer for wine -boyre pre hagofen and then he says a prayer for the khalah, and eats [not understood] a piece of khalah, and has, they drink wine, they have wine. Otherwise I have some soda, you know? I thought you were Jewish.

SIGRIST:

No. ( he laughs ) Mrs. Miller, I want to thank you very much. You've been, you've been wonderful. You answered all my questions.

MILLER:

Well, I don't know what I could do, you know? As I say, it's very hard, because I was married in, I think, 19, when was the war over?

SIGRIST:

1918.

MILLER:

1918.

SIGRIST:

The First World War ended.

MILLER:

We were married 1918, 1919, so it's a long time, too.

SIGRIST:

It's a long time. Anyway, this is . . .

MILLER:

I'm an old lady, it's okay, huh? ( they laugh )

SIGRIST:

This is Paul Sigrist signing off with Ceil Miller on . . .

MILLER:

Well, it's not, it's not . . .

SIGRIST:

What is it?

MILLER:

I could do more, but I forgot.

SIGRIST:

( he laughs ) You were great. Again, this is Paul Sigrist signing off with Mrs. Miller on, on Thursday, April 21, 1994, here in Elizabeth, New Jersey. Thank you.

MILLER:

Thank you. Thank you for coming. Thank you. EI-465/MILLER - 1 -