HAPEMAN:

Good afternoon. This is Mindy Hapeman for the National Park Service. I am a student intern for the Oral History Project from Skidmore College. Today is Thursday, November the 20th , 1997 and I am here in Maplewood, New Jersey with Josephine Scola, who came from Italy in 1920 when she was ten years old. Paul Sigrist is also present for the interview today. I should say for the sake of the tape that we are in a residential area and there might be audible neighborhood, traffic sounds. I should also say there are several family members in an another room in the house and their talking might be picked up on the tape. Why don't we begin by having you state your full name.

SCOLA:

My full name is Josephine Nardone Scola.

HAPEMAN:

Could you spell your maiden name?

SCOLA:

N-A-R-D-O-N-E.

HAPEMAN:

And your last name?

SCOLA:

Scola. S-C-O-L-A.

HAPEMAN:

Great. And what is your date of birth please?

SCOLA:

1910.

HAPEMAN:

Do you know the day?

SCOLA:

1910. Yeah. 1910. April the 15th.

HAPEMAN:

April the 15th, 1910.

SCOLA:

1910.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Where were you born?

SCOLA:

In Italy.

HAPEMAN:

Where in Italy?

SCOLA:

Prodlesera [PH]. (Italian)

HAPEMAN:

And, and where is that?

SCOLA:

Prodlesera [PH]. It's a, it's a small village in Italy. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Could you spell the name of your town?

SCOLA:

I can't tell. (She laughs) Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

That's fine. What was the size of your town? What was the size of it? How big was it?

SCOLA:

The what?

HAPEMAN:

The town that you grew up in.

SCOLA:

Oh, it's a small town. It was a small town.

HAPEMAN:

Do you know how many people might have lived there?

SCOLA:

Oh, I don't know. To me, it looked like it was only two block, two block. It's a, it was a small town. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What was the major industry there. What did people do for work?

SCOLA:

Well, my daughter, my mother was a widow. Her husband died very young and we lived there. My grandfather had some property, vegetable property, and my mother worked for my grandfather. And, my sister and I, we were home, you know, taking care of the house and we had to go to the village to carry water. We didn't have water in the house. And we had to carry water every day. We had to go to the end of the road and with the buckets we used to fill up the water and we used to carry them home to cook and everything. That's how we lived. It was a hard time. Yeah. So, then after my mother figured we can't live like this here, she says. So she wrote a letter to my, to her aunt. They lived in Paterson [New Jersey] and so she sent for my two brothers to go over, over there. She says, I'll get the jobs over here. In Paterson, there was a cotton company or something and two of them worked for the, them. And the other brother, I don't know what, what kind of work he was doing. So, my aunt. . .

HAPEMAN:

Before we get you to America, I'm just going to interrupt you for a moment and ask you a few more questions about what it was like to live in Italy. Could you tell me about the house that you grew up in?

SCOLA:

It was a small house. It was a small house. There was no dining room or, there was just the kitchen and the bedrooms. And, we had a fireplace and that's how we used to cook over there.

HAPEMAN:

And how was it lit? What, what kind of lighting did you have?

SCOLA:

What kind of a...?

HAPEMAN:

Lighting? For, how, how did you, was there gas lighting, or candles, or lanterns?

SCOLA:

No. The uh, we had candles. Yeah. And we cooked by a fireplace, fireplace, you know. We used to bring the charcoal and that's how we used to cook over there. There was no stove.

HAPEMAN:

What kind of things would you cook?

SCOLA:

Most of the time, it was vegetables. Vegetables and potatoes and stuff like that there, you know. And, it was nothing luxury like, like over here and so, so we got along so. Then after. . .

HAPEMAN:

Did the kids, did the kids help with the cooking? Were, was. . .

SCOLA:

No. It was just me and my sisters and my brother. My brother was two years older than us. Yeah, they helped. They helped a little bit. Yeah. They used to go the, even us, as small as we were, we used to go to the village there, where the market was and help my sister, I mean my mother with the planting the vegetables and stuff like that. The corn. Yeah. We worked hard. We worked hard as kids. Yeah. You know, when you have a, a, a mother without a husband, and you got to work, so you got to go along to help out. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

You have, you never met your father? You have no recollection of your father?

SCOLA:

No, no. I don't even know. The only way I know my father is through a picture. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Do you know what his name was?

SCOLA:

Leopold. Leopold. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What about your mother. What was her name?

SCOLA:

My mother was Judy.

HAPEMAN:

Judy.

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What was her personality like?

SCOLA:

Personality? Fine. She was a wonderful woman. Yeah. In fact, I have a granddaughter here next to my mother. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What did your mother look like?

SCOLA:

My mother was a beautiful woman. Yeah. (laughing) Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Could your mother read or write?

SCOLA:

Read or write? No. No.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. When you think about your childhood, do you have a special memory that you have of your mother in particular?

SCOLA:

Well, when we came here to America, she worked so hard over there. She could of had a better life here because then all of my brothers, they all had jobs. And, we lived on Church Street in South Orange [New Jersey] and then she became sick. She became sick. She was in and out the hospital. In and out the hospital. She had an operation. I don't know what kind of operation it was but anyway, it was until, it was just, well, I was married when my mother died. I was married a year, year and a half when my mother died. And, she was in and out the hospital at the Orange Memorial Hospital and so that was it. You know? Okay?

HAPEMAN:

Before, you mentioned a moment ago about your brothers and sisters. Could you tell me their names?

SCOLA:

Yeah. I have my sister, I have my sister right now in Brooklyn. She got married and she lived in Brooklyn. And, my, my other sister died and Cunzi. Her name was Cunzi.

HAPEMAN:

Cunzi.

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

And your first sister. The one that lives in Brooklyn? What was her name? What's her name. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, Margaret. Margaret.

HAPEMAN:

Margaret, Margaret.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah. And Cunzi was, was my other sister. And, myself. And then I have a, a brother that's Leo and a brother Joe and my brother Tony. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Do you know any stories concerning your birth? Do you know any, were you ever told anything about what, what happened the day you were born?

SCOLA:

What date that I was born? How can I go back that fa-, that far back.

HAPEMAN:

Not your memory but I though maybe there was a family story that you had heard but if, but if there's not, there's not. We'll, we'll keep going. Okay. What religion were you?

SCOLA:

Mm. What religion? Catholic.

HAPEMAN:

Tell me about religious life in Italy. Did, where did you go to church?

SCOLA:

Sure, we always go to church and even here too.

HAPEMAN:

In, in the town. . .

SCOLA:

All over. Where ever I went, I went to church.

HAPEMAN:

What was the church like that you went to in Italy? What did it look like?

SCOLA:

It was a small church. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What kind of religious practices did you have at home?

SCOLA:

What did I have what?

HAPEMAN:

What did you have, what kind of religious practices did you have right in your house in Italy?

SCOLA:

In Italy? Well, religious. We have candles and we have crucifix. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Did you ever experience any religious persecution, any bigotry in Italy?

SCOLA:

No.

HAPEMAN:

Tell me about school in Italy. Where did you go to school.

SCOLA:

Well, I was too young I think to go to school. I was too young to go to school.

HAPEMAN:

You didn't go to any school at all in Italy.

SCOLA:

No, no school at all until I came here, to America.

HAPEMAN:

As a, as a young girl growing up in Italy, what did you know about America?

SCOLA:

Oh, I thought America, I, oh, it was great. When we heard we were coming to America, my brothers, they send for us. We couldn't wait till we came here. And, and it was nice. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Tell me now, who was in America before you came?

SCOLA:

Who was here in America. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Who came before you?

SCOLA:

Well, we came to, we, we came to Paterson because my cousin, my aunt she send for my brothers and she also send for us. But then, I had an uncle who lived down the street and they made room for us. And because he had a house down there, and he made room for us for a few days and then next door there was a two apartment house and we were lucky to get that apartment and we lived there. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What did you pack to come to America?

SCOLA:

What did I w-?

HAPEMAN:

What did you pack?

SCOLA:

Packed?

HAPEMAN:

Yes.

SCOLA:

I don't know.

HAPEMAN:

Do you remember having luggage?

SCOLA:

I don't, we had some luggage. I think it was only one luggage. We didn't have too much.

HAPEMAN:

So, your two oldest brothers were already in America when your sisters, and your other brother, and your mother were sent to go. That's correct?

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Okay. How did you finance the journey? Did your brothers in America send money or did you have money to come to America?

SCOLA:

Well, my uncle, my grandfather gave us, us some money to come over. No, no, no. No, he didn't. It was my brothers. After working a year, they send for us. They're the ones who send us the money. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. The ones that were already in America.

SCOLA:

They were here in America. Yeah, that's right. That's right.

HAPEMAN:

Okay.

SIGRIST:

Mindy, excuse me. Before we get into America, I know I told you I wouldn't interrupt you but, you might want to ask Mrs. Scola about other relatives who lived in Italy.

HAPEMAN:

Can you tell me anything about other relatives that lived around in, in the town that you grew up. Was, was there an extended family? For instance, you just mentioned your grandfather. Was he around?

SCOLA:

My grandfather was a great man. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Did he live in the same town that you did?

SCOLA:

The same town. Lived in the same town. He had a big house there.

HAPEMAN:

What memories do you have of that. Do you remember going to the house?

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Many of times he used to call for us and, you know, what was interesting about him, he lived to almost a hundred years. And, he used to sit by a fire place, would you believe this, you know, I even hate to say this, and every day he would put a whole clove of garlic into the, into the ashes of the fireplace. Then he would have something that after, after that there, I think that's why he lived so long. He, he had a whole head of garlic almost every day because once that's cooked, you know, it doesn't smell like a, like a, you know, a garlic right away. And he used to go, sometimes I used to and see him and he used to say to me "Just pick it up with, from the ashes" and then he used to peel it, peel that garlic and he used to eat it like that there. And he lived to a good age, he lived a good age. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Was his house close to the house where you and your mother . . .

SCOLA:

Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. Like half a block away.

HAPEMAN:

Was this your mother's father or . . .

SCOLA:

My mother's father.

HAPEMAN:

Mother's father.

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Were there other family members around?

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah. I had plenty of aunts. Plenty of aunts. And my mother, just to keep us off the road, I had two aunts across the street. They were a seamstress. They, one aunt used to make a trousseau for the people that marriage, you know, and she used to call us over to go over there and to learn how to sew and stuff like that there. That's why I know so much about things like that there. I'm very handy myself, you know. As a kid with a needle in my hand sewing, you know, the trousseau for them, you know. It was nice. Yeah. (She pauses) Oh, yeah. There's a lot of things, you know. I'm living now, I'm eighty-six years old and I worked so hard. I didn't think I would live this long. But I think that the things that you do and you keep on going, that's what keeps you going. And thank God for that. Yeah. So...

HAPEMAN:

Are there any other memories, specific memories, that you have of growing up in Italy that stick, stick out in your mind that I haven't already asked you about?

SCOLA:

Well, I'm going to tell you something, that when we, before we came on the boat, when I tell this, I laugh, but it happened. And this is really happening. My uncles, see in Italy, we used to use only slippers, almost like this here (she gestures to her shoes), you know, different slippers. So, my uncles says to me, they don't wear slippers, the slippers were different over there. He said, they wear shoes. So, he went to Naples and he bought three pairs of shoes for me, my sister, and my brother. And so, he gave us the boxes while, while him and my mother through the rail to bring the luggage in. And so we were waiting and so they were there for almost an hour before we got on the boat, right. Now, I'm sitting in between my brother and my sister and I have three boxes of shoes. Now, this is embarrassing for me to say but it happened. And don't you believe that when my uncle and my mother came from behind the gate there to get on the boat and my uncle says to me, he says, "Where's the shoes?" My hands were like this here. They robbed three pairs of shoes right in front of-, and my brother and my sister didn't even see them and they took the three boxes of shoes, would you believe it? They couldn't come from the back because the bench was against the wall. They had to be on the front. And how they took those three boxes of shoes, I, I, I couldn't believe it. So, my uncle says, 'cause I started to cry because, you know, I felt bad. So he says, "Don't worry. You get on the boat with your mother." He says, "I'm going to go to the shoe store again" because he knew the size because he had gone out to get them. He says, "When you go, get onto, in the boat, you go up to the upper deck. And when you get up there, you tell the man on the boat there, I don't know what he called them, to throw down, down a rope and I'll be downstairs and I'll, I'll paddle a, you know, boat from the shoe store and I'll tie shoes to the, to the rope and he'll take them up." And, of course, it took a while. It took a while for us to get there and for him to go get the shoes and all. By the time, we went there and we went upstairs, it was me and my brother, we went up there, and there was my uncle on the boat there coming over so the, the, the, I don't know what you call the man that, that takes care of the boat, and so he got the shoes for, for us which was very nice, you know. Well, you know, the boats of back then it's not the boats you get today. Now, the boats today are luxury. You know, you sit down by the table to eat and all and stuff like that there. Over there, you can't, they don't do that. I don't know if you want to know that.

HAPEMAN:

I do.

SCOLA:

You want to know that?

HAPEMAN:

I do. I'm going to ask you some questions, but before we get into the boat, I want to ask you, first of all, how did you get from where you were living in Italy to where the port was? And which port did you leave from? You left from Naples?

SCOLA:

From Naples. Oh, yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. And how did you get to Naples from your town in Italy?

SCOLA:

Oh, I think one of the relatives. Well, my uncle, my uncle. They drove the carriage or something. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

You came by carriage.

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

And did this uncle, the uncle that bought you the shoes, did he come with you to America?

SCOLA:

No, no, no. He just came along to bring us.

HAPEMAN:

And was he the husband of one of these aunts that you were talking about or was he a brother of your mother?

SCOLA:

My uncle is a brother of my, my mother. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. Okay. He also lived around you.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. So, big family.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Was it hard to leave all those family members? How, what did, how did you feel about leaving Italy?

SCOLA:

Well, I didn't feel bad. I was happy to come because I knew that everybody talked about it. You know, in America, in America, you know, you live good, which is true, which is true. Nothing like it. Nothing like it. Of course, now they, after so many years, that they said over there they over there they're living good too, you know. But now, this goes back almost thirty years, you know. It's a long time. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. So, you're in Naples. You got there safely. What, tell me about the ship. You were beginning to talk about it. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, the ship, the ship.

HAPEMAN:

Do you know, do you remember the name of the ship?

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What was it.

SCOLA:

Christopher Columbus.

HAPEMAN:

The Christopher Columbus.

SCOLA:

Yeah. And it took twenty eight days to come over. Twenty eight days to come over.

HAPEMAN:

Twenty-eight days. Which, which class were you?

SCOLA:

The bottom. The bottom class.

HAPEMAN:

The bottom. Were you, did you actually have cabins or were you, were you, when you were on. . .

SCOLA:

No. We had the one-two-three. (she gestures)

HAPEMAN:

Bunk beds.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Bunk beds. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Okay. And what was that like, sleeping like that?

SCOLA:

Hmm?

HAPEMAN:

What was that like to sleep in those. . .?

SCOLA:

Terrible. Yeah. And the food was terrible?

HAPEMAN:

What was the food like? What kinds of foods did you see?

SCOLA:

(she laughs) To me, all I could remember was pasta, pasta, pasta. And you just go around with a, with a dish and they, they just plop just like they do in the, in the soldiers or something. (she laughs) Just plop, plop, and just walk around and go over to the, the bench or something and you eat it like that there. My mother was very sick on the boat. She hardly ate anything. Yeah. But we survived.

HAPEMAN:

Were you sick?

SCOLA:

No. Thank God for that. We, we were kids, you know. Ten years old. And my sister was nine. She's a year young-, younger than me. Tony's two years older. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What did people do on the boat for entertainment? Was there anything. . .

SCOLA:

No. We used to get together, sing. That's about it. It's not like now.

HAPEMAN:

What kinds of things would you sing?

SCOLA:

Italian songs.

HAPEMAN:

Do you want to sing one for us?

SCOLA:

No. I don't know how, I don't know anything. (they laugh)

HAPEMAN:

That's fine. That's fine. Were you, were your, was your family allowed to stay together or was there. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, we were always together.

HAPEMAN:

Were together.

SCOLA:

Yeah. We had three uncles, three, not uncles, three good friends of my brother's and . . .

HAPEMAN:

They were with you on the boat.

SCOLA:

They were on the boat. And they took such good care of us and especially my mother that was always sick. And, you know, they always made sure that they came down and checked on her and they used to bring some food to her. And it was like that. They were very, very good to us.

HAPEMAN:

Were they from your town as well?

SCOLA:

Yeah, from the town. They're from the town. And then when we came here, they lived around here. One lived over here on Irvington Avenue about a block away and the other two lived down in South Orange. Yeah.

SIGRIST:

I do want to pause just for a second. (break in tape)

SCOLA:

Do you know that when you get off the boat, you are being checked. I went through that now not too long ago, which I don't know whether they threw it down or something, you know, you have to go through a physical or something like that there? Thank God, they went by me. They came with up, you know, everybody was very good. And, I don't know if they do it now because I, I went through that Ellis Island not, quite a while ago and they had knocked down the, the physical. Well, I think you've been over there too. They knocked that all down. I don't know whether they do it now but they did it before.

HAPEMAN:

Now it's a museum.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Do you remember when you came into New York Harbor, seeing the Statue of Liberty?

SCOLA:

Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

How, how. . .

SCOLA:

Yeah. We saw the Statue. Well, that's how we know. It was dark at night and all the sudden somebody hollered out that they saw the sta-, the light. And, oh my God, everybody was so happy because it was twenty-eight days. That's a long time to be on the boat. Yeah. And, yeah, that's it.

HAPEMAN:

And then you went into Ellis Island and that's's what you were beginning to. . .

SCOLA:

Then, when we got off, wha-, we got off, see, we came to, we went to South Orange. And my brothers were still over my aunt and then after that, you know, they all separated. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Did you have to stay at Ellis Island? Were you detained there for overnight? You. . .

SCOLA:

No. Oh, no. Oh, no. No.

HAPEMAN:

But you do remember, or do you remember the medical tests, the medical exams or did you have to be examined by a doctor?

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah. They do check you because if you are sick or something, they don't let you off. Yeah. No.

HAPEMAN:

That's what you were saying thank God all your family members. . . .

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What do you remember about those, those tests?

SCOLA:

What do you mean "remember?"

HAPEMAN:

Do you remember any details about what specifically the doctors looked for?

SCOLA:

Oh, all they do is, they check your heart (a telephone rings in the background), to check your heart. You know, that's, that's the most important thing, you know. They, I don't know what they do now but that was the medical thing. They wanted to make sure you don't have a fever, get off the boat with a fever, something like that. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Do you remember eating at Ellis Island at all?

SCOLA:

Eating?

HAPEMAN:

Did you have any meals at Ellis Island?

SCOLA:

No. (she coughs) Excuse me. (she coughs)

HAPEMAN:

Who was waiting for you, you mentioned your cousin, was, was there someone waiting for you?

SCOLA:

My brothers. My brothers.

HAPEMAN:

Your brothers were waiting for you.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah. They came to pick us up.

HAPEMAN:

And where did you go once they picked you up?

SCOLA:

We came here, to South Orange. Yeah. We were over to my uncle's that lived down the street. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

And how long did you stay there?

SCOLA:

We didn't stay too long. We stayed there about four or five days and then we got an apartment next door to where he lives.

HAPEMAN:

What was that apartment like?

SCOLA:

It was nice. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

How many, how many rooms was it?

SCOLA:

We had, we had four rooms. You know, four rooms with the kitchen. Yeah. That wasn't bad.

HAPEMAN:

And, at this point, were the two brothers that were already in America living with you?

SCOLA:

No.

HAPEMAN:

It was just your mother and your sister, you and your brother?

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah. Up-hum.

HAPEMAN:

And what did your mother do? Did she look for work?

SCOLA:

No. I told you that before, that she became very ill. And most of the time, she was in the hospital. Yeah. And she died very young, too. Yeah. END OF SIDE ONE BEGINNING OF SIDE TWO

HAPEMAN:

How about you? Did you go to school?

SCOLA:

Yes.

HAPEMAN:

Tell me about what that was like.

SCOLA:

I didn't, I didn't go too long because my mother needed some money and so I stopped going and I had to go to the Montclair once a month because in between, I didn't make like, I didn't make like a full, full week of school. Like, I would go one day or maybe two days and the other days I had to go, I had to go to work. I worked very young. I worked in a florist, and seven, eight day-, seven, eight hours a day. And then, once a month, I had to go to this, I don't know what they call that, but I had to go to this place for school. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What other kinds of students were at this school?

SCOLA:

What grade? Not too long. Must of been two or three grades. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't go too long.

HAPEMAN:

Were there other Italians in the school?

SCOLA:

No.

HAPEMAN:

Were there other immigrants?

SCOLA:

I don't think so, no. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

How did you learn English?

SCOLA:

You just learn. You just learn. You go to school. They make fun of you when you can't, you can't spell or you can't talk but then, as you go along, you know, you learn.

HAPEMAN:

Do you remember specific examples of people making fun of you because you were an immigrant or because you couldn't speak?

SCOLA:

Yeah. They did. They did.

HAPEMAN:

Could you tell me about that?

SCOLA:

Well, sometimes, you know, like a, the teacher will say, "Well, touch the window" or "Touch the curtain" or something and you're touching the wrong thing. Naturally, who ever was there, they would laugh. They make you feel like an id-, you know. But, you survive, you know. You cry. You feel bad and. . .It worked out all right. Then, of course, as you grow up, you, then you get married and then you don't worry about school or anything. You worry about raising children. (she laughs)

HAPEMAN:

The neighborhood that you lived in when you first arrived here in America, where there a lot of Italians there besides. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah, a lot of Italians.

HAPEMAN:

A lot of Italians.

SCOLA:

The street that I lived, it was all Italians.

HAPEMAN:

Were there Italian businesses too or were there businesses that were run by other immigrants?

SCOLA:

I don't know but I know that the street that I was on was, they were all Italians and some of them had businesses, groceries and stuff like that. Some go to work and. . .

HAPEMAN:

How did you get the job at the florist shop?

SCOLA:

Oh, I, I just went over there. I just went over there and would you believe, they were paying you ten, ten cents an hour? Ten cents an hour. I worked hard an especially in the summer-time. It was a florist, a big florist and you had to come out and plant the, the plants and everything. I used to come home sweating, sweating and everything. And, so what are you going to do? It didn't kill me. I worked hard but I survived. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What were your brother and sister doing at this point?

SCOLA:

Well, my sister helped it too. My brother, my brother Tony worked for a construction man and he worked for him. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

How did you meet your husband?

SCOLA:

How did I meet my husband? Well, he lived a block after us. He lived on Church Street, I lived on Ridgewood Road. And, and his mother and my mother, they were friends at the time. And, so we just met. No, we met, we, we had to go to a wedding and we were invited to go to this wedding. I had to be a bridesmaid and he was the, the usher of the bride, you know, to go to them and that's how I met him. And after that, and then he called me up and he asked me for a date. And, very nice man. He's a great looking man. I have a picture of him over there (she gestures to a photograph) and so after six months that I went with him, we got married.

HAPEMAN:

What was his name?

SCOLA:

Anthony. Anthony Scola, that's my name.

HAPEMAN:

Was Anthony born in Italy or was he an American?

SCOLA:

He was born here.

HAPEMAN:

He was born here.

SCOLA:

Yeah. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Where did you live once you were married?

SCOLA:

Well, I lived, I had an apartment on Church Street and after that, I didn't stay too long, and then I, I came up to Maplewood and then we bought the house and that's, I've been living here ever since. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What, what did Anthony do for work?

SCOLA:

He used to work for a paper company in South Orange and he was the, the manager over there and he worked hard. He worked hard. He, he had to be there very early in the morning to stack up all the newspapers for the people to carry the newspapers around. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Did you continue to work after you were married?

SCOLA:

Did I work?

HAPEMAN:

After you were married?

SCOLA:

No, no.

HAPEMAN:

Did you have any children?

SCOLA:

Two.

HAPEMAN:

What, what were there names?

SCOLA:

(she laughs) My, my children? It's a Mary, Mary Josephine and Vincent. Vincent is named after his father and Mary is named after me. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

What kind of religious life did you have in America?

SCOLA:

What?

HAPEMAN:

What kind or religious life? Did you, where did you go to church?

SCOLA:

I went to church to Our Lady of Sorrows in South Orange. It's a Catholic Church.

HAPEMAN:

Was there a large immigrant. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah. Beautiful, beautiful. And, first, when we went, it was a small church and then they built this beautiful, beautiful church. It's a chapel like, you know. And, would you believe that I was the first bride in that, in that church to be married. Yeah. Yeah. It was nice.

HAPEMAN:

Have you ever gone back to Italy?

SCOLA:

No.

HAPEMAN:

Have you ever wanted to go back?

SCOLA:

No. No. When I think of it, the, the to-, the town, although a nephew of mine went and said that the town is so much better than it was years back. Of course, everything is improved, you know, and, uh, and no. If I want to make a trip, I will make a trip to a different place. Not over there. No.

HAPEMAN:

Did you maintain communication with all the family members in Italy that you left behind at all?

SCOLA:

No.

HAPEMAN:

What have you done in your life that you are most proud?

SCOLA:

What did I do?

HAPEMAN:

What are you most proud of-, what are you the most proud of that you've done?

SCOLA:

I don't know what you mean by that.

HAPEMAN:

Out of all accomplishments and all the things that you have done throughout your lifetime, what, what is it that you're most proud of?

SCOLA:

Well, I'm proud of the way I raised my children and my grandchildren. I have three grandchildren and I love them dearly. So, what, what else can I ask? (she laughs) Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Having lived here for as many years as you have. . .

SCOLA:

Oh, yeah. I've been in this house for so long. Now they want to move out because, you know, a lot of black people are starting to come in to the st-, on the street. And I told them, I says, especially my daughter. My son is married and he lives in Florida and he comes over once in a while, you know. And, of course, you know, she's, she's afraid, you know when she goes out at night or something. We, we have lights all over the, the house there, all around the house and I says, "But I've lived here for so many years. This is my house. Where am I going to go?" I've got friends and I've got cousins. We get together to play cards. Every Saturday night when I go to church, after church we go to my, my brother Tony lives in Maplewood here, we go play cards. And, I says, if I move, I says, I lose all that. I says, "This is what keeps me going. I want to be active. I have clubs that I go to. I have a club that I go every Monday night. St. Joseph church and then, once a month, there's a senior citizen club that I go to." You know, you keep on going.

HAPEMAN:

How long have you lived in this house?

SCOLA:

Oh, my God. So many years. I raised my children here. Yeah. So many years, yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Now that you've been in America for so long, what do you think about America?

SCOLA:

Oh, I think America, nothing like it. Nothing like it. Nothing like it. It's nice. Yeah.

HAPEMAN:

Well, I think on that note, we'll finish the interview, unless (Mrs. Scola laughs) there's something else you'd like to add? Or something else you'd like to add? (addressing Mr. Sigrist) This is Mindy Hapeman for the National Park Service. Today is Thursday, November the 20th, 1997 and I am here in Maplewood, New Jersey with Josephine Scola and we're now signing off. END OF INTERVIEW