APPLEBAUM:

This is Edward Applebaum, and I'm speaking with Mrs. Beatrice Quallo Korin on Thursday, June 11, 1986. We are beginning this interview at 12:55 in the afternoon. We are about to interview Mrs. Korin about her immigration experience from Cuba in 1913. This is interview number 197. Bea, could you tell me where you were born?

MRS. KORIN:

I was born in the Cayman Islands.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

When?

MRS. KORIN:

September 13, 1899.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

1899. So you're eight-seven years old?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess so.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And do you remember anything about living there?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Because what happened?

MRS. KORIN:

When I was living in Cuba?

MR. APPLEBAUM:

First tell me, on the Cayman Islands, what did your family do for a living there?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't know. I guess they just had--I can't remember. I guess they had their own land and planted their own food.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you know what your father did? What your father did for a living?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't know what he did there when he was an engineer. In Cuba, he was an engineer for the Spanish-American company.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

When did you move to Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

One day when I was a little girl.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you know why your family moved?

MRS. KORIN:

No. I guess they could make a better living there.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What was it like in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Cuba, to me, was a beautiful place. Everything was always green. I didn't like it when I came to America, 'cause it was so cold.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Where in Cuba did you live?

MRS. KORIN:

Lived in [San Noyes] and then [. . .]

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And your father worked as an engineer?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did your mother work?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you have brothers or sisters?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes, but they weren't old enough to work.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

How many brothers and sisters?

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see now--there's Leo, Larry--Leo, Larry--Leo, Larry, I can't think right away. There was Leo, Larry, [Kiko], [. . .] I had one sister.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you the oldest?

MRS. KORIN:

No, my sister was the oldest. Then Leo.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would you do as children? What were some of the games you played?

MRS. KORIN:

We jumped rope and played hide-and-go-seek.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you have other children that you were friends with?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did your parents like it in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. My father went there 'cause he know that my mother in the Cayman Islands, and he went there because he thought he could make a better living there.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What kind of engineering did he do?

MRS. KORIN:

He was a steam shovel engineer. And locomotive engineer.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you ever see him working?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you have a close family then?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

So why did anybody decide to leave Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, my father thought he could make a better living here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And what happened? Did he come over first? Or did your mother?

MRS. KORIN:

We all came over together.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What year was that?

MRS. KORIN:

1913.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Can you tell me about the trip over?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't know; I can't remember now.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you come by boat?

MRS. KORIN:

I have to think.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

I think you probably did. I don't know if there's any other way you could have traveled back then. So it was probably a ship that you took over?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you remember how you felt about leaving Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

I hated to leave.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What had you heard about the United States?

MRS. KORIN:

I heard everything about the segregation in the United States, and that black people didn't have a chance.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were black people treated fairly in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes, they don't make any difference.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

So you were unhappy, then, to be coming to the United States?

MRS. KORIN:

No, no. When I heard that, you know, that they treated black people so badly here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Had you heard anything else about it?

MRS. KORIN:

No. Not that I can remember, no.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were there any people from your village who had left before you to go to the United States?

MRS. KORIN:

Not that I can remember.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

So when you finally got to Ellis Island, in New York Harbor, do you remember seeing the Statue of Liberty?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And what did you think about that?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, it didn't interest me too much.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did your parents ever tell you anything about what the Grand Cayman Islands had been like?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes, I heard my father talk about it.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would he say?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, he just thought the people there were not as nice as he thought--

MR. APPLEBAUM:

You said that you weren't that impressed when you got to New York Harbor and saw the Statue of Liberty. What about the tall buildings?

MRS. KORIN:

The buildings were tall and you wondered about them.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What did you wonder?

MRS. KORIN:

What they were like to go in them. It's been so long ago. 1913, you know.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

The boat that you traveled on, when you came into Ellis Island, was it mostly black people that you were traveling with?

MRS. KORIN:

No. A mixture of people.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Where were some of the other people from?

MRS. KORIN:

Some of them came from Cuba, and some came from some of the other islands.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were your brothers and sister excited about coming? Or did they feel like you, that they didn't want to leave Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Some of them had mixed feelings. I didn't want to leave because I heard that they weren't nice to the black people here in America.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

When you finally got to Ellis Island, what happened?

MRS. KORIN:

Let me see if I can remember. It's been so long ago.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

I know. There was a problem with one of your brothers? Not speaking?

MRS. KORIN:

They thought he was mute, because he wouldn't answer them.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Why wouldn't he answer?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess he just didn't want to.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What language did you speak?

MRS. KORIN:

Spanish.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And when you got to Ellis Island, was there anybody there who spoke Spanish?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't remember. I guess there were.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you remember what you took with you?

MRS. KORIN:

Took what?

MR. APPLEBAUM:

When you left Cuba, what were some of the items that you took with you?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't remember.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you remember anything else about what happened on Ellis Island, any questions that people asked you, or what it looked like?

MRS. KORIN:

No. I don't remember now. People.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

The incident with your brother, when they thought he was a mute, what happened?

MRS. KORIN:

They didn't want to let him on, let us in, because they thought he would be a public charge to the government.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

So how was he able to come in?

MRS. KORIN:

[. . .] came over there, and made him talk.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

How did he make him talk?

MRS. KORIN:

I think he pinched him.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did your brother let out a yell?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

You didn't have any problem talking.

MRS. KORIN:

I don't remember that I did.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you remember seeing the people from other countries? That must have been new for you, to see so many different kinds of people.

MRS. KORIN:

[. . .] hear what people were talking about, because all of these people talk in different languages. Yeah, it was hard to concentrate.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you excited? Were you afraid?

MRS. KORIN:

I would say I was afraid.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you stay with your mother and father?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. When we first came here, we lived with my uncle.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Where did he live?

MRS. KORIN:

He lived in--if I can remember--

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Was it in New Jersey or in New York City?

MRS. KORIN:

New Jersey. Lived in Orange, I think. I can't remember.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you and your brothers and your sister go to school?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And the fears you had had about being treated badly as a black person, was that happening?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

This area that you lived in, was it mostly a black area?

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see, I'm trying to think now. No, it was a mixed area, if I can remember now.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

How did you adjust to the cold weather? You said you didn't like that?

MRS. KORIN:

At first, I didn't.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What happened the first time you saw snow?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, when I saw, it, I didn't know it would melt as fast as it did.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Was your father able to find economic opportunity here?

MRS. KORIN:

Better than he did in Cuba.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What kind of work was he able to get here?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, he was an engineer here, so he had work in that field. He was a--he could, he could drive steam shovels and locomotives.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you proud of him?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you able to make friends with other children?

MRS. KORIN:

I did. Of course, at first, it seemed like you was just came from the islands, and you know, I had to go out of your way to be nice to them. So that they know that you liked them.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Was it difficult for you to learn to speak English?

MRS. KORIN:

No, because, see my father was born in Jamaica, and he used to speak English to us at home. So we--I knew English when I came.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Where you went to school, were the children from different countries?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes, different children from different countries.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did people treat you differently because you were an immigrant?

MRS. KORIN:

The kids used to make fun of us.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would they say?

MRS. KORIN:

[That child] come from Cuba. Who wants to be bothered with [that old] Cuban [girl].

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you think that you wanted to go back to Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

At that point I did.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you ask your parents to take you back?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you think they were satisfied to have come here?

MRS. KORIN:

I know my father was. My father loved the United States.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What about your brothers and sister? How did they do?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, I think finally we all made friends with kids.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And where were some of the areas that you lived in?

MRS. KORIN:

See if I can remember now. You mean here? We lived in Orange.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Have you ever been able to travel back to Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

No. I hope someday I'll go back.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What do you think would have happened if you had stayed there?

MRS. KORIN:

We wouldn't have had the knowledge of anything that we have being here. And that's why my father wanted us to come here, for a better education. I wasn't--I didn't want to come.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

As a young person, did you see a lot of the prejudice that you had been afraid of?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. I went to school, they used to [threat] to kill me.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Would you fight back?

MRS. KORIN:

Yeah, but not fist fight. But, I'd [run 'em] off the best I could, you know, by telling them.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Would you tell your parents that this was hard, that the other children were ridiculing you?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would they say?

MRS. KORIN:

They wouldn't say anything. They'd say, "Oh, you'll get over that."

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And you did, right?

MRS. KORIN:

Yeah, eventually.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Let's just talk again for another minute about the trip over, if we can. You don't remember anything about the boat?

MRS. KORIN:

The boat we came on? Right now I can't remember.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What about on Ellis Island. Did they give you a medical examination?

MRS. KORIN:

They gave us a medical examination before we got off the boat.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you have to show that you had enough money?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you know if your parents were worried about being sent back?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't think--I didn't think they were. But that was a possibility. If you didn't have enough money to stay here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you think, as black people coming in, you were treated fairly?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes, I think so.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

I was asking if you felt you were treated differently as black people on Ellis Island.

MRS. KORIN:

No, we weren't treated any different.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What were some of the things that you saw in this country that you had never seen before in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

I'm trying to think now.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were there foods here that were new that you had never seen?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Which foods?

MRS. KORIN:

I have to think. But I know there were.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What about automobiles? Had you seen automobiles in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Not as plentiful as here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Or subways and streetcars.

MRS. KORIN:

No subways. Streetcars, we had.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Are you glad for your children and grandchildren, that your parents chose to come over?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. 'Cause they have a better opportunity here. [. . .] in Cuba. To come here, because I heard they weren't nice to the black people here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Who did you hear that from?

MRS. KORIN:

Different people would tell you that, who had been here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

There were people in your neighborhood who had gone to the United States and then come back?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

But your father decided to come anyway? Was it your father's decision or your mother's, do you think?

MRS. KORIN:

My father.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you have relatives that stayed in Cuba? Or in the Cayman Islands or in Jamaica?

MRS. KORIN:

My mother had relatives in the Cayman Islands. And I guess my father had some relatives in Jamaica, 'cause my father was from Jamaica. My mother was from the Cayman Islands.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did any of the relatives come and join you in the United States?

MRS. KORIN:

No. No one that I know of.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

You said you stayed--that your father had an uncle who was here when you came here?

MRS. KORIN:

I had an uncle--my father's brother was here. Uncle Steven was here. Living here.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

When had he come, do you know?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't know when he came. Many years back.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Can you tell me about Father [Plasket]?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, he was an Episcopal priest, and we used to go to his church, after we came here we went to his church.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

You met him first on Ellis Island though?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would he do on Ellis Island? Why did he go there?

MRS. KORIN:

You mean Father [Plasket]?

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Yes.

MRS. KORIN:

He came to get us out. Because my sister came here ahead of us with another family, and she knew him. And I guess he was asked to come and help us get out of Ellis Island.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

So he helped your family?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

How long ahead of you had your sister come?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess about ten or fifteen years.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did she write to the family and tell them what it was like in the United States?

MRS. KORIN:

She used to complain about my uncle not being nice to her.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did she have a job when you came here?

MRS. KORIN:

She was in school. She was still going to school.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you able to find a job after you finished school?

MRS. KORIN:

If I can remember, I think I did.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you know what kind of work you did?

MRS. KORIN:

Most likely, it was house work.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you work at a factory also during the war?

MRS. KORIN:

During the world war I worked in a factory.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did you spend all of the time living around New Jersey?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. We lived right in the Oranges.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

This is the end of side one of tape one of the interview with Mrs. Beatrice Korin. This is interview number 197. END OF SIDE ONE, TAPE ONE BEGINNING OF SIDE TWO, TAPE ONE

MR. APPLEBAUM:

This is side of two of tape one of the interview with Mrs. Beatrice Korin. This is interview number 197. Is there anything else you could tell me about your childhood in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

We lived in San Luis and we lived in [. . .] that was more a country place. Then we lived in San Luis. And finally we lived in Santiago.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What kind of towns were they?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, Santiago was a big city. The others were smaller towns.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

The other thing I'd wanted some information about, if you could remember anything about the boat trip over?

MRS. KORIN:

I'm trying to think.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Do you know where you got the boat? What the port was? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: When you came over--what part--did you leave from Santiago?

MRS. KORIN:

I think we left from Santiago. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Do you remember getting on the boat? Who was with you when you got on the boat?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess mama was with us. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And who else? Who else was with you? Where was Aunt [El]? Auntie [El] was here with Uncle Steven. So who else came with you and grandma?

MRS. KORIN:

Larry and Kiko, I guess. [Neil]. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Why do you say you guess? That's who came with you.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

I had a question about whether you remembered what your family took with you. Did you bring any special clothes, or any family furniture, any pictures?

MRS. KORIN:

My father was an engineer. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What did you bring over here? Did you move furniture, or did you just bring clothes?

MRS. KORIN:

We just brought clothes. We didn't bring furniture. UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Why didn't you bring furniture?

MRS. KORIN:

Because we didn't need to bring furniture. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Why? Who were you going to stay with?

MRS. KORIN:

We were staying with Uncle Steven. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And who was Uncle Steven?

MRS. KORIN:

That's my father's brother. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And where was he living at the time?

MRS. KORIN:

Uncle Steven was living in-- [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Where was he living at the time?

MRS. KORIN:

I'm trying to think now. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What city was he living in?

MRS. KORIN:

He was living in Orange. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Orange. And, your older sister? Aunt El?

MRS. KORIN:

Aunt El was living with him. Because she came here ahead of us.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

You know what else maybe you could tell me about a little? You said one of the reasons you didn't want to come was because you heard that black people were treated poorly in this country.

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And, so then when you came here, what did you finally see and feel?

MRS. KORIN:

Well, I didn't feel that we were treated that badly. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: When you came here, you didn't feel that way.

MRS. KORIN:

No, not after I was here. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Was that when you were little?

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see, how old was I when I came--twelve or thirteen? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Mm hm. But when you came here, and around that age, did you, did you find that anybody was discriminating against you? When you went to school?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. The kids used to make a lot of fun, they used to say, "Don't bother with that old Cuban girl. You don't want to be bothered with her." That's the way they used to say.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were you the only one from Cuba in the school?

MRS. KORIN:

That I can remember; I don't think there was anybody else there.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Were there other black children in the school?

MRS. KORIN:

American blacks.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

And did they discriminate against you also? Did the American black children make fun of you for being Cuban?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

It was just the white students?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Was that in school in Orange? You went to school in Orange.

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see, I first went to [Day Street] School, and then [West Side]. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: In Orange, were there any black kids at your school?

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see. Yes, I guess there were. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: There were more in Orange than in West Orange, right?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Where else did they--did you think that, that, they discriminated against you because you were Cuban? Or because you were black?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't remember the school. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What about at work, or in the work, or anything like that? Do you feel that you never got a job because you were Cuban or because you were black? Did you ever have any problems with that?

MRS. KORIN:

Not that I can remember now. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What about your brothers and sister? Did you tell them what happened when you, you landed in Ellis Island? What happened? Did you tell them?

MRS. KORIN:

No. I'm trying to think what happened. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: When you got to Ellis Island, you told us a story--you said Uncle [Pico] he was the youngest, and he wouldn't talk, and so what happened?

MRS. KORIN:

They wouldn't let us in. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Wouldn't let you in where?

MRS. KORIN:

The United States. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Why?

MRS. KORIN:

'Cause they thought he was a mute, and he would eventually become public charge.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Didn't your parents ask him to speak to show that he knew how to talk?

MRS. KORIN:

I forgot how they got him to talk eventually. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Who came--did grandpa come with you, then?

MRS. KORIN:

No, I think he was here. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Grandpa was here?

MRS. KORIN:

Yeah. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: When you came?

MRS. KORIN:

I think he was here ahead of us. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Mother, you need to think that one again. Didn't grandpa send grandma and you and Pico and Neil and Larry, and he stayed and worked?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Huh?

MRS. KORIN:

So he could have money to support us over here. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Right, okay. So, what happened, how did they finally let you in the country?

MRS. KORIN:

I can't remember. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What's the story you said about Uncle Steven bringing who over there? Who did he bring over there?

MRS. KORIN:

He brought Father [Plasket]. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And who was Father [Plasket]?

MRS. KORIN:

The priest in the Episcopal church that he, my uncle was going to. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And what did Father [Plasket] do? Who did he talk to over there? So that you all could come in the country?

MRS. KORIN:

I can't remember. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Was it some of the authorities? Hmm?

MRS. KORIN:

I think so. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Was it because they were worried about your whole family, not only Pico, being a public charge?

MRS. KORIN:

Not the rest of the family. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And did they--what did they feel that grandma was going to do to support you?

MRS. KORIN:

They thought she was gonna be a prostitute. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Right. And who convinced them differently?

MRS. KORIN:

Father [Plasket]. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Father [Plasket]. So, how many days--do you remember how many days you stayed on Ellis Island?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't remember now. I know it's more than a week. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: It was more than a week.

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What do you remember about being on Ellis Island? Do you remember getting off the boat and going to Ellis Island? What was the island like?

MRS. KORIN:

I can't remember now. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: You can't remember now? Remember that we took you over there on your birthday a few years ago?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And you saw some of the places?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And you seemed to remember them then. Do you remember where they gave you the medical exam? Remember where they gave--the doctors looked at you?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What happened when the doctors looked at you?

MRS. KORIN:

I can't remember. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: You can't remember. So, how did you get over to Uncle Leo, then? Uncle Steven? Did you go on a train, or a bus, or what? When they let you off the island? Did you have to take a boat? To come over to the state?

MRS. KORIN:

I don't think so. I don't remember. I'm trying to think when I first come over here. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: When you first came over here, you went to Uncle Steven.

MRS. KORIN:

Yeah. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Well, tell them. They want to hear about it. What happened when you got to Uncle Steven's?

MRS. KORIN:

He wasn't so nice to us. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: All right. Well, tell them why wasn't he so nice. What wasn't nice about him? Why wasn't he nice to you?

MRS. KORIN:

I'm trying to think. You know, it's been so long ago. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: He had a family of his own, right?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And, how many children were in that family?

MRS. KORIN:

He had two, a girl and a boy. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And, what happened? Why do you feel he wasn't so nice to you? Did he demand more of you, did he make you work harder than his own children, or what?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Do what?

MRS. KORIN:

He used to make us do all the work, while his children just sat around.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What about your cousins, his children, did they treat you nicely, or did they treat you differently because you were immigrants? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: How did Amy and--

MRS. KORIN:

--and Albert? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And Albert treat you?

MRS. KORIN:

They weren't so nice to us. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Were Amy and Albert born here?

MRS. KORIN:

Huh? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Were they born in the States--Amy and ALbert? They were born in the States?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: But, Uncle Steven's wife was from where?

MRS. KORIN:

Jamaica. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And then grandpa had his other brother who lived here. Who was he?

MRS. KORIN:

Uncle Henry. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Uncle Henry. And, his wife, was she American?

MRS. KORIN:

She was American. She was nice. Aunt [Carrie] was very nice.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What would your family do for entertainment, when, if your mother or when your father came, if they were going to take you out for a treat, what was a special thing that the family did together?

MRS. KORIN:

Let's see, I can't remember. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What did you do for fun? What did you enjoy doing when you were a child?

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Would they ever take you into the movies, for example, in Newark? Or would they take you into Manhattan?

MRS. KORIN:

No, they didn't take us to the movies, that I can remember. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: I think she's right there. You know, money was very scarce. I don't think they did any of that kind of socialization. Most of the time, where did you go to have fun? Or did you go anywhere to have fun? What about church?

MRS. KORIN:

We used to go to church; that's where we had fun. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: That's where you had fun. There were young people's groups?

MRS. KORIN:

There were young people's groups there.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Would you write to your father, who was back in Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And when did he come over?

MRS. KORIN:

Much later.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Was that difficult for your mother, you think, to be away from him?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess so, but she never complained.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did things get better with your uncle and your cousins? Did they start to accept you? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Did the relationship between Uncle Steven and you family, did it improve? Did it get better?

MRS. KORIN:

I think eventually it did. I can't remember too much. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: What happened--when did you move from Orange to West Orange? And what happened then? Who bought land in West Orange?

MRS. KORIN:

Uncle Steven bought a lot. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And who else?

MRS. KORIN:

Then my mother bought a lot. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Right next door.

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And both of them did what?

MRS. KORIN:

Built a home there. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Is that when the relationship got better?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Did your father send the money so that your mother could afford to buy a home?

MRS. KORIN:

He sent the money so she could feel at home.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

What was it like? Was it the first home your family had ever owned?

MRS. KORIN:

No, we owned a home in Cuba. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Can you tell them something about grandpa? You said he was an engineer. Tell them something about the kind of work he did.

MRS. KORIN:

Grandpa was an engineer. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Your father.

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And where did he work?

MRS. KORIN:

He worked for the Spanish American Iron Company, which was an American company. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And, how did he educate himself?

MRS. KORIN:

What do you mean? [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: How did he educate himself? How did he learn how to read and write?

MRS. KORIN:

He took courses in American School of Correspondence. That's how he learned to be an engineer, the American School--Chicago.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Was he the first one from his family to get that far into schooling?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Well, he must have really wanted to go to school. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Why did he send you all over here? What was the reason he went you all over here?

MRS. KORIN:

So we could get a better education. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And what happened since you been here? Who got the education? Who pursued it? How far did Uncle Chico and Uncle Leo and--

MRS. KORIN:

They went to college. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And Uncle Larry?

MRS. KORIN:

They went to Hampton, they finished Hampton. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: No, only one.

MRS. KORIN:

Leo. Leo went to Hampton. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Institute.

MRS. KORIN:

Institute. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: In Virginia.

MRS. KORIN:

In Virginia. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And where did Leo--where did Kiko and Larry go?

MRS. KORIN:

[Hofstra] College. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Here, in East Orange?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And, at the time, what did they do while they were there? They played what?

MRS. KORIN:

They played football.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Your father and mother were very proud of them?

MRS. KORIN:

Oh, yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And Aunt [El], what was her vocation? What did she do to earn a living?

MRS. KORIN:

She used to sew. She used to do dressmaking. She always wanted to go to--what's that school in New York? She always wanted to go to-- [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: [Drexel] for the fashion institute?

MRS. KORIN:

What's the name of that school in New York? It's a dressmaking school. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Drexel, I think.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

For fashion. Were the boys encouraged to go to school more than the girls?

MRS. KORIN:

No. Everybody was encouraged to go to school. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And, what happened with you and Aunt [El], that you didn't complete your schooling? What happened? What did you do? What did Aunt [El] do?

MRS. KORIN:

[. . .] [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: And what did you do?

MRS. KORIN:

I guess I did the same thing. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Right. And you have how many children?

MRS. KORIN:

Eight. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Four. What do you have, all boys or all girls?

MRS. KORIN:

I got a mixture. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: How many of each?

MRS. KORIN:

I can't think [. . .] Larry, Malcolm, George, Malcolm, George, Larry. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: He lives in California.

MRS. KORIN:

George. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Walter.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Okay, I want to thank you very much for spending this time with us, and telling us a little bit about your life. Is there anything else you want to tell us?

MRS. KORIN:

Not that I can think about now. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Are you glad that you're here instead of in Cuba? Are you glad that you came here?

MRS. KORIN:

Yes. [UNIDENTIFIED VOICE]: Have you been back to Cuba?

MRS. KORIN:

No.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

Okay, thank you very much.

MRS. KORIN:

You're welcome.

MR. APPLEBAUM:

This is the end of side two of tape one of the interview with Mrs. Beatrice Korin. This is the end of interview number 197.